Entry tags:
[victory road] IC CONTACT
[For private communication, Pokegear or otherwise!]
You have?
Is
Everything okay?
[What a perfect segue to get away from talking about his own problems! Talk about someone else!]
Is
Everything okay?
[What a perfect segue to get away from talking about his own problems! Talk about someone else!]
[Shiro don't think he doesn't see what you're doing there!! But he can't exactly... not answer that, so.]
Kinda depends on how you define that, honestly? It's mostly an issue of long-term baggage more than anything immediate. Though, I'll admit, that whole mess just now sure did remind me why I should go back (but to be clear, a lot of people can benefit from therapy, whether they're currently struggling or not).
Kinda depends on how you define that, honestly? It's mostly an issue of long-term baggage more than anything immediate. Though, I'll admit, that whole mess just now sure did remind me why I should go back (but to be clear, a lot of people can benefit from therapy, whether they're currently struggling or not).
[He winces a bit. "That whole mess" is right. He feels like he should apologize again for the whole thing. Even though he knows what the response is going to be.]
Anyone ever tell you you're a good man?
[Maybe a bit off-topic, but. It's clear from this entire line of conversation, to him, anyway. Grant is just a good man. A kind, concerned person who really seems like he has things figured out.]
[It's impressive, really.]
Sorry, I
It just kind of hit me there.
Anyone ever tell you you're a good man?
[Maybe a bit off-topic, but. It's clear from this entire line of conversation, to him, anyway. Grant is just a good man. A kind, concerned person who really seems like he has things figured out.]
[It's impressive, really.]
Sorry, I
It just kind of hit me there.
[You're a good man. What a straightforward, genuine, very platonic compliment. There is absolutely no excuse for the way it thumps into his chest.
Stupid. He's literally talking to Shiro right now about how he should seek therapy to help him cope with the disappearance of his husband. Stupid.]
Ha
Now and then
Thank you though. You too
[Stupid]
Stupid. He's literally talking to Shiro right now about how he should seek therapy to help him cope with the disappearance of his husband. Stupid.]
Ha
Now and then
Thank you though. You too
[Stupid]
Edited 2021-07-07 07:01 (UTC)
[Fortunately for Grant, Shiro would be completely oblivious, even if this conversation were happening in person.]
Now and then
[Fingerguns!!]
I
appreciate it though. I really do
I'm not great at this - talking about myself but
thanks
Now and then
[Fingerguns!!]
I
appreciate it though. I really do
I'm not great at this - talking about myself but
thanks
[Steven is so not bothered by it.]
Oh, I was wondering if it was something like that--well, that you were some sort of supernatural, anyway. I mean, I wasn't going to bring it up if you weren't comfortable--and there was always a chance you were just a bear with pronounced canines--but you *do* have those lovely teeth, after all. So if you're a werewolf, that does make sense.
(Ah, not that I expect it's quite the same from world to world, but even so.)
But yeah. Back home there's kind of this... whole justified fear of becoming like the people who took us, so Lance's bullshit kind of hit right there, because even though I wasn't taken for those kinds of purposes, I've known people who had been. And with Thace, well, what Lance said probably reminded him of what he calls the 'cultural corruption' of his people. (There was a very nasty, very long-lived emperor who put some awful practices into place, from what I understand.)
Oh, I was wondering if it was something like that--well, that you were some sort of supernatural, anyway. I mean, I wasn't going to bring it up if you weren't comfortable--and there was always a chance you were just a bear with pronounced canines--but you *do* have those lovely teeth, after all. So if you're a werewolf, that does make sense.
(Ah, not that I expect it's quite the same from world to world, but even so.)
But yeah. Back home there's kind of this... whole justified fear of becoming like the people who took us, so Lance's bullshit kind of hit right there, because even though I wasn't taken for those kinds of purposes, I've known people who had been. And with Thace, well, what Lance said probably reminded him of what he calls the 'cultural corruption' of his people. (There was a very nasty, very long-lived emperor who put some awful practices into place, from what I understand.)
I appreciate that. I really do.
And I'll talk to Lance. You've got my word on that. I'm sorry, again, that he pulled that stunt.
And I'll talk to Lance. You've got my word on that. I'm sorry, again, that he pulled that stunt.
I will. Might take a while, but, I know him - anyone can get through to him if they try enough.
I'll do whatever I can.
If there's anything else you ever need, I'm game.
[Least he can do for Grant attempting to help him with problems Shiro's not sure he even wants to be helped.]
If there's anything else you ever need, I'm game.
[Least he can do for Grant attempting to help him with problems Shiro's not sure he even wants to be helped.]
Ha. Yeah, it is usually the teeth that tip people off.
[Which he can't say is a pattern he's fond of, but it's good to hear that it doesn't sound like Steven had been making any guesses before now besides suspecting something was up. Makes sense, given Steven's own position.]
Oh god, for sure... I've already put way too much time and effort into keeping from doing or saying anything that could possibly read as "predatory", and every time someone says some crap like that anyway it just feels
I dunno. Inescapable.
And that's without the added layers of history, like you and Thace seem to have there... I mean, it goes without saying that being taken like that, for any purpose, and what was done to Thace's people, were awful. I'm really sorry to hear that.
[Which he can't say is a pattern he's fond of, but it's good to hear that it doesn't sound like Steven had been making any guesses before now besides suspecting something was up. Makes sense, given Steven's own position.]
Oh god, for sure... I've already put way too much time and effort into keeping from doing or saying anything that could possibly read as "predatory", and every time someone says some crap like that anyway it just feels
I dunno. Inescapable.
And that's without the added layers of history, like you and Thace seem to have there... I mean, it goes without saying that being taken like that, for any purpose, and what was done to Thace's people, were awful. I'm really sorry to hear that.
Oh *Grant*. I'm so sorry. I don't know if you'll believe me, but I *do* understand. For the first forty years of my life, *I* spent a lot of time trying to come off as non-threatening. Well, I'm a gay man of color with a non-typical psychology and no particular desire to draw the ire of racists and homophobes. Keeping my head down always seemed like it was the better part of valor.
You never met me before I went home for six years, but I even held myself differently when I was younger, like I was *trying* to minimize how much space I took up. Because I was. I'm not a big as you, but I'm *not* a small man either. And people can find that intimidating.
Well. I won't really go into what changed there. But I *do* get it.
And I know Thace would too. He's very conscious of not coming off as the big scary alien invader with people, especially ones like Shiro who've encountered Galra before.
[He hesitates for a moment before adding,]
(Regarding Thace's people... the kinds of things he's told me happened were done *to* the Galra and *by* the Galra, to each other as 'disciplinary measures' and to the people they conquered. The Galra as a whole are far from guiltless... but they weren't *always* like that and their nigh-immortal emperor did a *lot* to twist them.)
You never met me before I went home for six years, but I even held myself differently when I was younger, like I was *trying* to minimize how much space I took up. Because I was. I'm not a big as you, but I'm *not* a small man either. And people can find that intimidating.
Well. I won't really go into what changed there. But I *do* get it.
And I know Thace would too. He's very conscious of not coming off as the big scary alien invader with people, especially ones like Shiro who've encountered Galra before.
[He hesitates for a moment before adding,]
(Regarding Thace's people... the kinds of things he's told me happened were done *to* the Galra and *by* the Galra, to each other as 'disciplinary measures' and to the people they conquered. The Galra as a whole are far from guiltless... but they weren't *always* like that and their nigh-immortal emperor did a *lot* to twist them.)
Edited (typos/wording) 2021-07-22 03:12 (UTC)
Text (a few days after his last texts, after Pidge texts him)
![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
fingersandteeth
2021-07-22 02:58 am (UTC)(link)
Well, it's just *great* to know that I don't have to actually *make* any threats for people to decide that I'm threatening Lance. It would be one thing if they were pissed off at me for the nasty things I said to him. I'd *get it* if they were angry about the things I implied. But I keep getting told I *threatened* him and I didn't.
I mean, I *did* put my scary asshole gameface on to say that to him. I won't deny that. But I didn't *actually* threaten him. I attempted to humiliate him and then I scolded him. *Thace* snarled at him and then scolded him. *Neither* of us actually made threats.
Jesus fucking *Christ*, Grant. I thought I was finally *done* with smiling and eating shit, but I guess the fuck not.
[Someone is a little bitter at being yelled at for the things he didn't do and not the things he did.]
I mean, I *did* put my scary asshole gameface on to say that to him. I won't deny that. But I didn't *actually* threaten him. I attempted to humiliate him and then I scolded him. *Thace* snarled at him and then scolded him. *Neither* of us actually made threats.
Jesus fucking *Christ*, Grant. I thought I was finally *done* with smiling and eating shit, but I guess the fuck not.
[Someone is a little bitter at being yelled at for the things he didn't do and not the things he did.]
Edited 2021-07-22 02:58 (UTC)
I have some apologies to make for my behavior at the auction. Will you hear them?
[Oh. Oh dear.
Grant tries his best to think back over the auction and its immediate aftermath, and... has to admit his memory of it is kind of fuzzy. Which is no surprise, he guesses.]
Shit
Okay, to be clear I am not doubting a single thing you're saying but I've got to ask - what DID get said? I feel like I remember someone saying something about threats but I'll admit I wasn't super processing a lot of what was said so I couldn't deny it at the time, sorry
Related, I take it something else happened?
Grant tries his best to think back over the auction and its immediate aftermath, and... has to admit his memory of it is kind of fuzzy. Which is no surprise, he guesses.]
Shit
Okay, to be clear I am not doubting a single thing you're saying but I've got to ask - what DID get said? I feel like I remember someone saying something about threats but I'll admit I wasn't super processing a lot of what was said so I couldn't deny it at the time, sorry
Related, I take it something else happened?
[So part of the difficulty here is that Grant is discovering - or, perhaps, given his prior knowledge of how he responds to this kind of thing, confirming - that he... doesn't remember very much of of what happened at the auction. He remembers what Lance said, remembers Steven and Thace reacting, remembers talking briefly to Thace immediately afterward and then to Shiro over text a while later.
He does not remember very much of the... details of anything between Lance's outburst and his conversation with Shiro. So now he's got to ask:]
For sure, if... sorry, this is kind of weird, but if you can tell me what you're apologizing for? I'll admit, my memory of a lot of it is kind of fuzzy, but I don't remember any reason you'd have to apologize to me.
He does not remember very much of the... details of anything between Lance's outburst and his conversation with Shiro. So now he's got to ask:]
For sure, if... sorry, this is kind of weird, but if you can tell me what you're apologizing for? I'll admit, my memory of a lot of it is kind of fuzzy, but I don't remember any reason you'd have to apologize to me.
[It takes a while for Steven's reply to come, the reasons which will be pretty obvious once Grant reads it.]
Yeah. You were, well, clearly disassociating. I'm not surprised your memories of what happened are fuzzy.
Normally this is when I'd link the staryutube video, but I don't want to trigger you again. So. It went like this:
LANCE: [makes a bullshit orgy comment]
YOU: [stunned denial of orgy]
THACE: "That joke is in very poor taste--" [notices you shutting down, snarls reflexively] "Let me be very clear. I would never expect anything sexual or romantic in a situation where money is involved, even in such a way as this where everyone agreed to be 'auctioned.' The implied power imbalance is vile."
ME: [menacingly to Lance] "If you truly believe that Shiro will be forcibly screwed by the winner, one wonders why *you've* been betting so fiercely. You do realize you could just proposition him, rather than dubiously attempt to purchase his sexual favors from a charity auction—or are you worried you'll be turned down?"
SHIRO: [completely done with everything] “100,000 and we end this right now. I’ll pay it myself and we can all stop threatening Lance.”
THACE: [wincing] "My apologies, Shiro. My only intent was to offer a quiet evening among friends, which is still on offer, auction or not, if you want it." [glares at Lance] "You should apologize as well. To Shiro especially."
JASKIER: "*LANCE*! Bloody hell."
SHIRO: [says something privately to Jaskier, then to everyone else,] “Lance doesn’t bother me at this point. I think I’m done though. For real.”
ME: [wincing] "I'm sorry, Shiro. I suppose I wanted Lance to see how it felt to have someone publicly accuse him of having the worst, most sordid motives for his actions... and I didn't think of how much it would hurt you. I understand if you don't want to talk with or see any of us for a while, though."
LANCE: "Why's everybody getting mad at me?! You're the ones who kept adding people! This thing is for a date date, not monopoly. Don't get salty because I'm taking trying to get someone to drag Shiro out of his closet bedroom for once in the last two years seriously. And I'm a married man. Shiro couldn't have me even if he wanted. No offense, bro, but Pidge, man."
ME: [rolling my eyes] "Oh please. As if I'd ever propose we play something so plebeian. It would have been Settlers of the Catan Region at the very least. That said, I do have some advice for you, Lance. You should know that implying that men like the four of us are only driven by sexual motives is incredibly offensive for any number of reason--and whether or not you meant it that way, that's how it came off as. *Think* before you say these things."
THACE: [taking deep breaths] "Firstly, had you considered whether or not Shiro wanted a romantic date? He had no objections to my offer of a quiet dinner and games. Perhaps that's why he allowed himself to be auctioned, rather than romance." [momentary pause] "Which is not required to get out among people in the first place, for one. I can't claim to know his mind, but perhaps this was his attempt at getting out on his own. I regret that it ended the way it did, but I don't regret scolding you about your words."
At which point Jaskier moved onto the next date. Some other things were said privately to people, I think, but that's what ended up on the video.
And yeah, something else sure as fucking happened. Lance's *wife* messaged me and threatened to castrate me if I threaten her husband again. The ensuing discussion has not gone well. Give me a sec and I'll cap it for you.
[He does, up to the part where he tells Pidge that if he'd threatened Lance, she would know.]
I, ah, may have invoked you shutting down as a reason I said what I did. Which is more or less true. If you hadn't, I'd have skipped the public humiliation and gone straight to the scolding, but at that moment, I was trying to focus people's attention on myself.
That said, I probably shouldn't have told Lance's wife about your disassociating without asking you first and I'm sorry about that.
Yeah. You were, well, clearly disassociating. I'm not surprised your memories of what happened are fuzzy.
Normally this is when I'd link the staryutube video, but I don't want to trigger you again. So. It went like this:
LANCE: [makes a bullshit orgy comment]
YOU: [stunned denial of orgy]
THACE: "That joke is in very poor taste--" [notices you shutting down, snarls reflexively] "Let me be very clear. I would never expect anything sexual or romantic in a situation where money is involved, even in such a way as this where everyone agreed to be 'auctioned.' The implied power imbalance is vile."
ME: [menacingly to Lance] "If you truly believe that Shiro will be forcibly screwed by the winner, one wonders why *you've* been betting so fiercely. You do realize you could just proposition him, rather than dubiously attempt to purchase his sexual favors from a charity auction—or are you worried you'll be turned down?"
SHIRO: [completely done with everything] “100,000 and we end this right now. I’ll pay it myself and we can all stop threatening Lance.”
THACE: [wincing] "My apologies, Shiro. My only intent was to offer a quiet evening among friends, which is still on offer, auction or not, if you want it." [glares at Lance] "You should apologize as well. To Shiro especially."
JASKIER: "*LANCE*! Bloody hell."
SHIRO: [says something privately to Jaskier, then to everyone else,] “Lance doesn’t bother me at this point. I think I’m done though. For real.”
ME: [wincing] "I'm sorry, Shiro. I suppose I wanted Lance to see how it felt to have someone publicly accuse him of having the worst, most sordid motives for his actions... and I didn't think of how much it would hurt you. I understand if you don't want to talk with or see any of us for a while, though."
LANCE: "Why's everybody getting mad at me?! You're the ones who kept adding people! This thing is for a date date, not monopoly. Don't get salty because I'm taking trying to get someone to drag Shiro out of his closet bedroom for once in the last two years seriously. And I'm a married man. Shiro couldn't have me even if he wanted. No offense, bro, but Pidge, man."
ME: [rolling my eyes] "Oh please. As if I'd ever propose we play something so plebeian. It would have been Settlers of the Catan Region at the very least. That said, I do have some advice for you, Lance. You should know that implying that men like the four of us are only driven by sexual motives is incredibly offensive for any number of reason--and whether or not you meant it that way, that's how it came off as. *Think* before you say these things."
THACE: [taking deep breaths] "Firstly, had you considered whether or not Shiro wanted a romantic date? He had no objections to my offer of a quiet dinner and games. Perhaps that's why he allowed himself to be auctioned, rather than romance." [momentary pause] "Which is not required to get out among people in the first place, for one. I can't claim to know his mind, but perhaps this was his attempt at getting out on his own. I regret that it ended the way it did, but I don't regret scolding you about your words."
At which point Jaskier moved onto the next date. Some other things were said privately to people, I think, but that's what ended up on the video.
And yeah, something else sure as fucking happened. Lance's *wife* messaged me and threatened to castrate me if I threaten her husband again. The ensuing discussion has not gone well. Give me a sec and I'll cap it for you.
[He does, up to the part where he tells Pidge that if he'd threatened Lance, she would know.]
I, ah, may have invoked you shutting down as a reason I said what I did. Which is more or less true. If you hadn't, I'd have skipped the public humiliation and gone straight to the scolding, but at that moment, I was trying to focus people's attention on myself.
That said, I probably shouldn't have told Lance's wife about your disassociating without asking you first and I'm sorry about that.
Edited 2021-07-22 22:13 (UTC)
I'm not sure if you were having a moment of panic, or your mind was withdrawing, or both. Steven had a word for it that I don't remember at the moment. I'm so sorry that your memories were affected. I can only imagine that making things more distressing in the aftermath.
And I fear my reaction to Lance's comment and your distress only distressed you further. I am not human. My species has different reactions to stress and I snarled and bared my teeth at Lance. I have worked to control such reactions for a very long time, because I don't want to distress or frighten other species, especially since so many have been hurt by members of my own species. And I'm learning as a result of this that humans are very threatened by the gesture.
In light of that, I'm apologizing. My control slipped, and I am truly sorry for that. Is there any way I can make amends?
And I fear my reaction to Lance's comment and your distress only distressed you further. I am not human. My species has different reactions to stress and I snarled and bared my teeth at Lance. I have worked to control such reactions for a very long time, because I don't want to distress or frighten other species, especially since so many have been hurt by members of my own species. And I'm learning as a result of this that humans are very threatened by the gesture.
In light of that, I'm apologizing. My control slipped, and I am truly sorry for that. Is there any way I can make amends?
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